Schroth Fiberglass
America’s Favorite Boatshop
J-22 General Maintenance Pricing
January 1999 -Updated November 2005
These are old prices and may or may not even be useful as a guide
This list is an attempt to predict prices for various processes and repairs to the J-22 sailboat. Certainly, no two J-22s are presented to our shop with identical histories. These prices are predictions based upon labor and materials previously consumed in the performance of similar tasks on other J-22 sailboats or sailboats generally. We can make more accurate predictions when we actually inspect individual boats. Some boats bring problems which only present themselves after removal of dirt, fittings, coatings, or layers of structure. Therefore, the prices described here only cover that part of the tasks about which we already know enough to make an accurate prediction. Generally, anything we have not specifically described below is not included in the prices described below.
Keels
We have consistently shaped J-22 keels since we built our latest templates in1988. The One Design class has rules. We designed our product to meet those rules and to optimize performance with out violating One Design intent. The J-22 builders changed the location of the keel on the production boat sometime around the completion of J-22 number 1200. The newer J-22s are built such that the keel needs to have less removal of material and less restructuring to create the very best J-22 Class legal keel.
Some older J-22s have huge voids in the aft section of the keel and / or fractures around the junction of the hull and the sump. On some older boats stiffness of the keel hull intersection can only be re-created by adding additional laminates. These are problems which consume additional materials and labor and we must estimate those costs on an individual basis.
Basics
Hang, measure, and design keel fairing process: $100
Remove unnecessary materials (grind filler, lead, and fiberglass): $300
(may be as little as $200 for boats over 1200)
Add depth to meet 720 mm max: $200
Add chord length in front: $300 ($200 over 1200)
Fair keel and prime: $600
Above steps total: $1500
Finish Selections
Coat keel with gelcoat and polish: $500
Coat keel with VC Performance Epoxy and polish: $700
Coat keel with antifoulant: generally included in price of bottom job
Separately from bottom job:
Coat keel with hard antifoulant: $100
Burnish hard antifoulant: $300 (includes more expensive paint and labor)
Prepare and apply VC 17: $150
Rudders
The builder supplied J-22 Class legal rudders we have seen over the last 20 years are remarkably similar and universally built about one centimeter too fat. The structure of the rudder is fiberglass laminate over a core. The core contributes nothing to structure other than to hold the skins apart. The entire thickness of the outer shell structure is very close to a half centimeter.
Translation? Minimum thickness is not easily attained. It is not possible to grind away enough thickness without destroying the structure of the blade.
For the last 20 years we have simply ground away as much material as we are willing to grind. We will not build a “break away rudder” for you. We will present a rudder which is shaped as well as we can shape it and strong enough to provide safe service. Our “best we can do” rudders have won the J-22 North American Championships and the competitive Texas Circuit. If price and J-22 Class rules were not a consideration, it would definitely be possible to build a faster J-22 rudder. None of our One Design J-22 customers has felt a need to violate the spirit of the J-22 Class rules (“builder supplied”) and we are not inclined to start a new spending war.
Generally, the prices below assume we will work only on the part of the blade which flows through the water. Removal and reinstallation of fittings and / or finishing of the non immersed parts of the rudder must be addressed separately.
Rudders with cracking or brown stains around the fasteners most certainly have some rotted core. The severity and decisions to repair or replace, must be addressed individually.
Basics
Sand and shape rudder: $300
Finishes
Gelcoat and polish: $400
Epoxy coat for extended under water use and hard antifoulant: $250
Burnish Hard Antifoulant: $150 (includes more expensive paint and labor)
Epoxy coat for extended underwater use and VC 17: $300
The Bottom (under and near the water line)
J-22s have been presented to us with bottoms ranging from brand new factory gelcoat with mold release residue to blister and barnacle covered. We offer finishes ranging from rolled on ablative antifoulant to as flawless as the depth of the owner’s wallet. In the interest of completing this document there will be a lot of generalization.
Floating storage
Removal of old antifoulant: $400
Application and hard antifoulant: $550
Removal of failed epoxy and old antifoulant: $600
Repair of blisters: $0 to $1000
Application of 3 gallons 2000/2001 Epoxy and hard antifoulant: $800
Burnish antifoulant: $600 (includes extra thickness / more expensive paint)
Application of 4 gallons epoxy, sand, apply VC 17 antifoulant: $1200
Trailer Storage
Removal of old antifoulant: $500
Removal of failed epoxy and old antifoulant: $750
Basic preparation of a bare gelcoat surface: $400
Application of new gelcoat: $600
Application of VC Performance Epoxy coating: $800
Fairing and Finish Options
Sand and polish gelcoat surface: $1000
Sand and Polish VC Performance Epoxy surface: $1200
Fair hull (18” sander and some filling) before coating application: $500
Additionally fair hull as part of polishing process: $500 and up
This option assumes we are trying to present a flawless or near flawless hull. The initial sanding must be done more carefully. The preparation for coatings uses more time and material. The final coatings must be applied with additional thickness to endure additional sanding. More curing time must be allowed before sanding so that curing after the sanding will not be as severe.
Note: Plastic surfaces and structures continue to cure for decades. The boat will always continue to cycle between moisture absorption and drying. The surface will not remain “forever as it leaves the shop.”
The sanding must be done with more care by skilled laborers who are paid at a much higher hourly rate. For a J-22 whose gelcoat is generally in like new condition, the creation of a “masterpiece” hull, below the waterline, will consume over $3000 of labor and materials.
We cannot give firm prices for ultimate bottom fairing. We have the right facilities and a capable staff. Fairing is a straight foreword and relatively simple process. Virtually any flaw which we can see can be corrected. The cure for flaws is more skilled labor using more materials. We attempt to agree about a target and price. We produce, as we understand it, the described target. If that product does not meet the goals of the customer, we re-define the target and spend more customer money.
Topsides (between the water and the gunwale)
Many J-22s were delivered to Texas in the early and mid 1980s. The plastic has been exposed to the sun, water, wind, docks, other boats, and pollutants while Reagan, Clinton, and two Bushes have been president. We are pretty good at cleaning and polishing but the realities of time and abuse have certainly taken a toll. The boat owner has to decide how pretty, how durable, how much to spend, and when. The following is an attempt to help with the decision.
Keeping the Original Gelcoat
If the gelcoat is not cracking everywhere like a dried out parched field in a drought, or worn away, it can generally be polished to a shine. We can fill scratches and patch actual holes in the hull and for the most part our color matches successfully hide the repairs from all but the closest inspection.
Gel coat patching: A single color match and simple repair costs about $300. Much of the time for one patch involves separate steps, positioning the boat, getting the tools out, putting the tools away, disposing of trash and etc. There is a huge economy of scale for multiple scratches and holes. Suffice it to say, a lot of scratches can be repaired for the price of a paintjob. We can usually look at a boat and give a reasonable prediction about topside gelcoat repair costs. Painting is usually reserved for those who want a new color or otherwise want to make their boats appear as new.
Polish and wax the topsides: $220.
We machine buff the hull and apply one coat of wax. We can apply additional coats of wax or we can pass the care of the boat to the owner. Buffing compound is abrasive. Some gelcoat is lost each time the boat is polished with compound. The only two ways to avoid removing layers of precious gelcoat are to leave the dirt on the boat or continue to wax and protect the boat. You can avoid the use of polishing compound for years at a time by applying a fresh coat of wax two or three times a year.
Painting the Topsides
Urethane topcoats (Awlgrip): $2000 and up.
In 1984 R. S. Means published the definitive handbook for boat maintenance pricing. The national average price to paint the topsides on a 25 foot hull which was in excellent condition was $2500. This included sanding, priming, sanding and application of a topcoat. Repairs, old finishes in poor condition, or the addition of stripes added to the $100 per foot price. Back then, gas cost $1 per gallon, workers were paid $5 per hour, new pickup trucks cost $10,000, and a gallon of paint cost $50.
We have a separate handout which describes our topside painting prices. Generally, we cannot paint a J-22 with Awlgrip for under $2000. That is our bargain paintjob which will stand up to close inspection. A truly magnificent paintjob on a J-22 using Awlgrip as the topcoat will probably consume around $5000. The good news? You can choose any color you love.
Re-gelcoating: Our favorite material for creating beautiful new topsides remains good old gelcoat. The original gelcoat on J boats built in the 1970s is still surviving and on some well kept boats looks very nice. There has been another 30 years worth of technology developed since those boats were created and today’s gelcoats should last even better than the original J-22 finish.
Gelcoat is cheap, easy to apply and easy to repair. The only labor intensive parts of a refinish job using gelcoat come after the coating is applied. It takes a lot of sandpaper, compound, wax, and a lot of labor to sand, polish, and wax the sprayed surface. The end result can be nearly perfect. The re-gelcoated boat can be repaired as easily as a new boat.
Re-gelcoating and polishing J-22 hull topsides in good condition can be accomplished for around $3000.
Fairing the Topsides: The condition and fairness of the hull mostly controls the cost. Decisions about removing large humps, such as those found at the bulkhead intersections with the hull, impact the cost. An extra $500 spent on sanding and fairing before applying the gelcoat will contribute mightily to ultimate fairness. The addition of extra layers of gelcoat and an extra $500 spent on sanding with long tools after the gelcoat is applied should allow a nearly perfect product to be created. Large waves at bulkheads would not be fixed with only $500 as those waves may only be fixed by adding incorrect thickness and weight or removing large portions of the hull skin and re-laminating those areas. An individual deformation around a bulkhead could consume $1000. It is also questionable whether the J-22 Class Association would approve of such a modification / repair.
Note:
If the goal is to create the very most beautiful and functional J-22...
If the plan is to keep the boat for many years…
If the plan is to use the boat and maintain it as close to perfection as possible.
If the boat will absolutely not be left in wet storage for extended periods…
We recommend using gelcoat for every surface including the deck.
Teak Replacement
Handrails: We make ours from thicker teak than stock. We will create and install a new set of handrails for $250
Toe rails: About $2500
The original ones are glued on with 5200 as will be our replacements. We will make new teak rails, rip off your old ones, and install new ones for only $2500. If you want the cheap white plastic look for your boat we will remove the elegant teak rails for $1000 and install the plastic rails at our hourly shop rate. Last time we did a J-24 it took two men one very long day to accomplish the task. The materials will include the new rails, the J-Boat recommended sealant, and J-Boat recommended fasteners.
Deck Painting
Recoating the Non-skid: $300 and up.
Many J-22s were painted in two tones. The non-skid gelcoat was applied with a brush and today, those brush marks show. We have developed a system where we apply a thin coat of urethane paint with some flattening agent. The result is a non skid which is durable, all one color, has the same woven fabric look, and works like new.
Repainting the Entire Deck: Time and Materials
Special Consumer Warning!! We hate painting decks. Every time we have painted a deck we have taken way longer than we imagined possible. Although the finished products have been absolutely gorgeous, no one involved has been happy. In every case, the owner was frustrated by the fact we failed to meet our planned completion date and we found ourselves borrowing money and making late payments to our suppliers and creditors. Decks and painting are lousy for our attitude, friendships, and business.
Although we pride ourselves in being a full service facility, we do not care if we ever paint another deck. We certainly will not solicit customers looking for another deck paintjob. If we paint another deck we will protect our financial situation in every way possible. This does not mean we will rip anyone off. We simply will not work on a deck paintjob unless we are paid for or time and materials. We will only paint a deck using a time and materials formula and we will NOT discount either the materials or our labor.
Gelcoat: $5000 and up.
Having written all the above, we believe we can probably paint a J-22 deck with fresh gelcoat for somewhere in the neighborhood of $5000.
Our coatings design allows us to remove your old gelcoat and replace it with material and distribution of that material’s weight which virtually matches the original One Design J-22.
Our non-skid will be a rough rolled on texture which is similar to that which Hunter used on its stock boats in the early 1980s. It is NOT slippery.
The smooth parts of the deck will appear as though they were never touched but the gelcoat will be entirely new material.
Urethane: Somewhere between $5000 and $10,000.
Just as with gelcoat, we will log every hour, every drop of paint, and every piece of tape and sandpaper and bill you for the full amount. Remember, we don’t care whether we ever paint another deck again and we are not soliciting any of that sort of business!! Urethane sucks as a deck coating. It chips, scrapes off, and is hard to repair. If you insist on having us paint your J-22 with urethane and that awful non-skid consisting of sand thrown in the paint, we will help you mess up your boat. We will remove enough gelcoat and use enough primer to maintain the original weight distribution. Among racers, thin lightweight paint raises suspicions. We will be available if you are protested for attempting to improve the boat in an unsportsmanlike manner.
Deck Fittings Gudgeons and Rotted Core
If you have brown stains around any stainless fitting, something is rotted inside. Water does not rinse tannin from stainless fittings or fiberglass. Additional clues are cracks in the gelcoat near fittings and fasteners which need to be re-tightened.
Repair of rotted core is tedious and time consuming. We can remove old hardware, clean out nearby rotted core, replace core with suitable materials, and reinstall fittings. We can also do the task properly. There is no decent way to predict how long it will take to repair a rotted area until that area is thoroughly excavated and the rot is removed. We perform this sort of work at our standard shop hourly rate and we charge for whatever materials we use.
We understand none of our customers has a money tree or is ready to hand us a blank check. For that reason we work with many of our boat owners on fitting removal and reinstallation. We are happy to do any part or the entire task. You can deliver the boat with the fittings removed. Arrangements can be made for you to spend your spare time in the field beside our shop tinkering with your many rotted fastener penetrations. You can replace the fittings yourself. Every sailor has his own level of interest in boat maintenance and we try to accommodate all of them.
Moving fittings and filling the holes behind them: Time and materials.
There is no way to predict how long it will take to fill any hole and we must come to an agreement about how bad the patch will look. Unless the deck is repainted, THE REPAIRED HOLE WILL SHOW FOREVER. We hate drilling new holes in a deck and moving fittings because we know every penetration is a golden invitation for rot and every hole in the original gelcoat is forever.
Inside the boat
J-22s have a wooden bulkheads, seats, cabin sole, and sometimes other inside parts which, when left wet, rot. We have visited inside other J-22s whose air tight tanks have rotted, but we have not performed tank repairs in our shop. The drain hoses, from cockpit to transom, shrink with age and eventually one or the other end pulls from its fittings.
Cockpit drain hose replacement: About $150.
If somebody has to crawl all the way to the back of the boat and if the concern is sinking or filling up the cabin in every rainstorm our opinion is we should replace all four plastic fittings, add new hose clamps and use decent hose. It only takes a couple guys about an hour and the fittings, hose, clamps, and caulk will be the cheapest insurance you ever bought.
Main bulkhead replacement: $300 to $1500.
Bulkheads rarely rot entirely. Usually, we replace only the parts which have rotted and enough adjacent wood to make the installation stronger than the original. We try to save and reuse the original teak trim pieces.
Cabin sole replacement: $200 to $500.
It really depends how much rot happened near the rotted sole. It also depends on whether we use teak and holly faced plywood and just how gorgeous the finish on that plywood shall be. Suffice it to say, a sole protected with wood preservative and teak oil takes a lot less effort to create than one which is epoxy coated on the edges and bottom and varnished to a shine on top.
Seat replacement: $300 to $1000.
The original seats are mahogany faced marine ply and the side rails are teak. They are supported by wood cleats which often rot and often take some of the adjacent bulkhead along the rot path. We have had a fun time using other kinds of wood for the rails and almost any wood is less expensive than teak.
We do not like the way the cross step is held in place. The pins are not a very user friendly system. The original seat rails are damaged on almost 100% of the J-22s by problems relating to those pins. We prefer to create a cleat which captures the step between the stopper and the short bulkhead.
Keel sump repair: About $500.
If there are cracks outside the hull at the keel sump joint, or if there are cracks inside the boat in the same area, we recommend adding some fresh structure before the problem becomes more serious. We grind for better adhesion, laminate, and gelcoat the finished structure so it looks like the day the new boat was delivered.
Refurbish the interior gelcoat surface: About $420.
The builders used a very nice coating. We have never seen any peeling inside a J-22. The surface often does mildew and look ugly. All it takes to make most J-22 interiors look new again is a bottle of bleach and some scrubbing tools. We will crawl around and ruin our clothes while doing our best to make that inside look great again for only $100 per hour plus the materials. This is one of those jobs anyone can do. If you feel it is such a bad job you want to pay some sucker to do it, we understand, and we have our price.